*sigh* (twice now since this is too long for a response post)
2002-Aug-27, Tuesday 11:58 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
ssurgulWell, naturally, I had a very long response (which was all venting) prepared, and I was going to ask if you'd prefer a slight method change before posting it. Then, of course, the fucking machine opted to lock and I couldn't get in to save shit.
So. Firt off, I have pondered something here. Would you prefer if I had two part responses? First part being as analytic and factual as possible, coming after the emotional venting response chronologically, but prior to the venting in the post? That way you can see the abstractions from reaction first, deal with them, and then have the option of dealing with the emotionally charged and potentially hurtful reaction. Just a thought.
I'm not going to put this into notepad to work on it. I'm just going to post it, hoping to ensure that the system won't die on me again.
Let me state for the record that I honestly don't know where some of these statements of yours come from. I have had times with two persons. Doug I was having here because he was to be in the area anyway. And from our chats it seemed possible that something might develop in the future. From his own admission and situation, far in the future. He's still in school and won't be done for a goodly while (a couple of years likely). So, if nothing else happens on my or his end, it's that long, at least, before he'll be able to seriously entertain the notion of a relocation.
Scott/Kati/Jake I have been chatting with for a bit, but I had been talking with him off and on for a couple of years. He piqued my interest then, and then when we were chatting online, he reinforced the interest rather sharply. Yes, he's a possible slave, yes so is Doug. But, I talked again with him last night, and made sure beyond a shadow of a doubt that he understands that I'm not looking for anything right now.
Of course, through chatting, I discovered that he had told you about the curve and the keys, which naturally would only reinforce your feelings of worthlessness. But, he's getting them back tonight, which was the agreement made when he gave them to me in the first place. It was a trust building exercise, one he actually initiated himself. I took them to build that trust, knowing full well that I wouldn't be holding them all the time, or even most of the time. I doubt you'll care to hear that at this stage, since your absence and your LJ entries make it fairly clear that you've come to several conclusions which are not correct, to my thinking. But, that's your choice.
On the flip side, I'd also ask you to look at habits yourself. How many times have you been over at others', having sex with them? With how many different people have you been sleeping? How many of those were with people you'd just met at that gathering, or had limited contact prior?
Quantitatively, I have to really question my two (of which neither has really had anything as relaxing as penetration or sucking or anything happen yet) when compared to your numbers. I don't typically enjoy vanilla sex, unless it's with someone I have deep feelings for or someone I don't care if I never see again. I tend to always look for submissives to play with, short or long term. Just because you're not looking for a long-term BDSM situation right now doesn't mean that I won't be either. Granted, I'm not looking for a BDSM LTR at this point, because I know it's not the time at all for it. And my own illogic WRT that situation is being nicely overpowered by my own pains caused by the past 18 months, thanks. Just because I'm trying to find a few people that I can have some occasional encounters with does not mean that I'm setting out to replace you out of the gates and rub your nose in it. I just have grown rather bored with what you can live with sexually (vanilla play) and I choose to look for other enjoyment. And if something happens longer term because of the play now, well then something happens. I'm not going to push now for it, I'm just going to push for occasional 'companionship' of the type that will bring me enough pleasure to warrant the time expenditure.
That being said, if you can't or won't understand that, well, it's as straight, upfront, and emotionless as I can make it. Sorry you can't see the venting post, as it encompassed a lot more of my feelings on this, but those feelings are spent on the 2 pages of ranting which died a hideous death last night. I think the only significant thing I'd expect to be taken away from this is the distinctions in what is viewed as being sexually available. You're just fine with little porn shows of yourself through web cam. You're just fine with having lots of vanilla sex with multiple partners a night. You're just fine with 'basic' leather sex. I am not. My desires for general, non-relationship encounters runs differently. While jealousy is a reaction you can have, and your feelings based on that reaction are valid, bear in mind that your definitions of acceptable and enjoyable for sexual things are very different than mine, and I'm reacting on mine as you've reacted on yours.
So. Firt off, I have pondered something here. Would you prefer if I had two part responses? First part being as analytic and factual as possible, coming after the emotional venting response chronologically, but prior to the venting in the post? That way you can see the abstractions from reaction first, deal with them, and then have the option of dealing with the emotionally charged and potentially hurtful reaction. Just a thought.
I'm not going to put this into notepad to work on it. I'm just going to post it, hoping to ensure that the system won't die on me again.
Let me state for the record that I honestly don't know where some of these statements of yours come from. I have had times with two persons. Doug I was having here because he was to be in the area anyway. And from our chats it seemed possible that something might develop in the future. From his own admission and situation, far in the future. He's still in school and won't be done for a goodly while (a couple of years likely). So, if nothing else happens on my or his end, it's that long, at least, before he'll be able to seriously entertain the notion of a relocation.
Scott/Kati/Jake I have been chatting with for a bit, but I had been talking with him off and on for a couple of years. He piqued my interest then, and then when we were chatting online, he reinforced the interest rather sharply. Yes, he's a possible slave, yes so is Doug. But, I talked again with him last night, and made sure beyond a shadow of a doubt that he understands that I'm not looking for anything right now.
Of course, through chatting, I discovered that he had told you about the curve and the keys, which naturally would only reinforce your feelings of worthlessness. But, he's getting them back tonight, which was the agreement made when he gave them to me in the first place. It was a trust building exercise, one he actually initiated himself. I took them to build that trust, knowing full well that I wouldn't be holding them all the time, or even most of the time. I doubt you'll care to hear that at this stage, since your absence and your LJ entries make it fairly clear that you've come to several conclusions which are not correct, to my thinking. But, that's your choice.
On the flip side, I'd also ask you to look at habits yourself. How many times have you been over at others', having sex with them? With how many different people have you been sleeping? How many of those were with people you'd just met at that gathering, or had limited contact prior?
Quantitatively, I have to really question my two (of which neither has really had anything as relaxing as penetration or sucking or anything happen yet) when compared to your numbers. I don't typically enjoy vanilla sex, unless it's with someone I have deep feelings for or someone I don't care if I never see again. I tend to always look for submissives to play with, short or long term. Just because you're not looking for a long-term BDSM situation right now doesn't mean that I won't be either. Granted, I'm not looking for a BDSM LTR at this point, because I know it's not the time at all for it. And my own illogic WRT that situation is being nicely overpowered by my own pains caused by the past 18 months, thanks. Just because I'm trying to find a few people that I can have some occasional encounters with does not mean that I'm setting out to replace you out of the gates and rub your nose in it. I just have grown rather bored with what you can live with sexually (vanilla play) and I choose to look for other enjoyment. And if something happens longer term because of the play now, well then something happens. I'm not going to push now for it, I'm just going to push for occasional 'companionship' of the type that will bring me enough pleasure to warrant the time expenditure.
That being said, if you can't or won't understand that, well, it's as straight, upfront, and emotionless as I can make it. Sorry you can't see the venting post, as it encompassed a lot more of my feelings on this, but those feelings are spent on the 2 pages of ranting which died a hideous death last night. I think the only significant thing I'd expect to be taken away from this is the distinctions in what is viewed as being sexually available. You're just fine with little porn shows of yourself through web cam. You're just fine with having lots of vanilla sex with multiple partners a night. You're just fine with 'basic' leather sex. I am not. My desires for general, non-relationship encounters runs differently. While jealousy is a reaction you can have, and your feelings based on that reaction are valid, bear in mind that your definitions of acceptable and enjoyable for sexual things are very different than mine, and I'm reacting on mine as you've reacted on yours.
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Vent first.
on 2002-Aug-29, Thursday 06:21 pm (UTC)We discussed my issues with your using the term 'slave' to refer to others. I think we got sidetracked from the original point of contention: I am not looking for another Master, and I am certainly not going to call any of the people I play with (even in a BDSM sense) 'Master' or 'Lord'. I am holding those terms sacred, in a way -- even though they are words that would/could commonly be applied in a scene sense. You, however, constantly refer to your subordinates as 'slave', 'pup', 'pony', or some other kind of degrading word, and you quite often imply or explicitly state femininity in your reference to your submissives. Thus, 'slave' and 'slavegirl' or 'slave-', which is a set of words that I felt extremely attached to, and which held power over me... well, you're using them willy-nilly. Whether you mean it this way or not, it implies a sense of devaluation of me -- specifically, a devaluation of what we lived through as Master and slave.
(Furthermore, it also appears moderately inconsistent with your teachings: Call a spade a spade, don't call something by other than its name... but your relationship with -all- submissives is 'slave', even though you had stated that a slave is something else, something with a much more-vested emotion to you. [I know that you have explained the difference between your fantasies and your reality -- but to be honest, I still can't understand.])
I -am- quite certain, however, that I misspoke myself in my original complaint, making it seem as though your playing around was what was pissing me off. In a very specific sense, it is... your playing around with a term that meant a lot to me.